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Dan
Learner
5 Posts
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 Posted - 29 Oct 2006 : 2:35:18 PM
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Hi there, I need some help to solve this problem, if I idle around at about 80km its ok but as soon as i put my foot down or slowly speed up to 100km the oil light comes on and the motor runs out of oil and I have to pull over turn it off and re-start then its fine again until I go over 85km, so far I've drained the oil, filled it with diesel run the motor for 5 mins then put fresh thinner oil (10/40) and filter but no change, on examining the old filter I noticed fine black sand like stuff coming out.
Has anyone had the same thing or no how to fix it?????????
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trizo
Forum Moderator
3091 Posts
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Posted - 30 Oct 2006 : 7:13:12 PM
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wat in the name of holy crak did u fill the oil with deisel 4?am I reading this right or am I still blind!!!
ok from wat I'm thinkin it may b a series of problems..Is there a engine light on if so a error code may help!but not always there r a few thing that come 2 mind 1rst of all did u put the right grade oil bak in?the problem with running a thinner oil is that it can clean gunk out that is filling a void (as stupid as it seems)but at the moment this aint the problem sooory I'm digressing..ok its not the filter cause u changed it ..so incorrect oil in the first place wich is not heating right and causing bunky pressure oil pump may b blokd or the oil pik up pipe may blokd with gunk?or it may b ur oil pressure sender faulty of loose? so give these a thought and let us know wat happens?the other fella's will have sum other ideas but 4 now give them a crak good luk ;) |
3 can keep a secret if 2 are dead |
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Dan
Learner
5 Posts
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Posted - 30 Oct 2006 : 10:59:07 PM
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| Thanks for the reply Trizo, I thought Diesel would be a good idea because its like degreaser, it was'ent just Diesel I put a litre of oil as well for a bit of protection. The sender is ok because when the oil light comes on the motor rattles big time so it definetly runs dry, I'm thinking gunk in the pick up or pump, before I changed the oil I took off the housing the filter screws onto and in one of the channels which seemed to go nowhere was this thick dry hard stuff, I almost needed a jack hammer to get it out, thats why I thought the Diesel might help if that stuff is through the rest of the motor, I don't think the old owner changed the oil much the filter had 2001 on it. Is it common in the first VN motors to have oil pump problems and are they easy to change? or would getting a good second hand motor work out easier, they seem cheap I see them for around $400. |
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mouce
National Driver
1525 Posts
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Posted - 31 Oct 2006 : 12:51:17 PM
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YES...finally, someone actually used diesel to properly clean their engine! And, no, trizo, you saw it right, it's one of the best ways to flush the oil system in your car. Normally a 50/50 mix is okay, but there's no reason you can't use a bit more diesel.
Onto the problem at hand: As I see it there are three possibilities.
1) The oil pump is dead, the only way you're going to know this is if you hook up an oil pressure gauge and check the pressure.
2) The pickup in the sump is blocked. This is very common, especially after having flushed the engine. It dislodges all the crud from inside the oil system and can easily block the mesh filter on the end of the oil-pickup. The bad news is that to get at it you need to drop the sump, I've never done it myself, but from those I've spoken to about it, it's a whore of a job.
3) The oil is way too thin. Okay, I can sort of understand why you put in the 10/40 oil, but it's a big mistake. These engines even when new, has such large tolerances in the bearings that 15/40 oil is the minimum they should run. Unless you've had your motor rebuilt there's a VERY good chance that the reason that you're pressure it too low is that the oil is just not thick enough to come up to pressure. The oil that I use (and recommend) is the Penrite HPR series. If your engine doesn't have too many oil leaks then HPR15 should be fine, if it's like mine and has a few issues with the rear main seal then HPR30 is better.
Changing the motor is a bit of a gamble. You already know all the quirks that your engine has got. And you can never be certain of the condition of the 'new' motor to go in. Even if it's rebuilt, unless you know what parts went into it, there's no way of knowing if you're going to be getting a really strong motor that will do 350,000km or if you're getting a lemon that might last 350km.
That said, if you're going to go to the hassle of getting a new oil pump (and it's probably not a bad move if it's as gummed up as you say it is), then check out the condition of your timing chain/tensioner while you're doing the work. Since you'll be in the area you might as well do it all.
Getting a 'new' motor has one big advantage. You'll have lots of spare parts for it, or you can take your old engine and get it rebuilt and reworked to get a few extra ponies out of it ;) |
Bite off more than you can chew, and chew like hell - Peter Brock (1945-2006) |
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Dan
Learner
5 Posts
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Posted - 31 Oct 2006 : 9:22:55 PM
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Thanks mouce, yes I thought Diesel was good I've used it before on a VL 6 that had a simalar problem and it came good, as for this motor not as much luck, its a shame because the motor seems strong & has lots of power but has rattles at the front under idle which is the timing chain I guess. I think i will give it one more Diesel wash and then replace the oil pump and clean the pick up not a job I'm looking forward to but It has to be done,
is the oil pump an easy job once the harmonic balancer is off and I've heard a special tool is needed when putting the balancer back on to get it over the crank angle senser is that right?? |
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trizo
Forum Moderator
3091 Posts
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Posted - 01 Nov 2006 : 01:45:51 AM
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| ok ok ok wow horses lol wen i had the problem with the water in my oil dan where were u? lol @mouce duh!!!!;) |
3 can keep a secret if 2 are dead |
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Dan
Learner
5 Posts
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Posted - 02 Nov 2006 : 11:09:13 PM
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| Thats an easy job Trizo, I think I'd pefer to whip the heads off and fix that one (thats if thats all it was ? head gaskets) than pull half the car apart to get a silly sump off, anyway I have'ent done it yet because I need the car to get to work until my next break, the first day of my shift I had to click it into N turn it off and back on about 10 times to and from work so I decided the oil needs to be thinner (against all reccomendations) because the oil light only comes on when the motor gets to normal temp, meaning when its cold the Viscosity of the oil is thinner and as it heats up and thickens I lose pressure so I done the unthinkable and drained a bit of oil and replaced it with Diesel, and it worked, for the last 2 days I have driven 180km a day to the middle of nowhere at 100-110kmph without a problem its like a new car, I no its a dodgie fix but at the same time it might be fixing the problem by cleaning it fully, I'll try some normal oil in a week and see what happens... |
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mouce
National Driver
1525 Posts
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Posted - 02 Nov 2006 : 11:30:55 PM
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Uh...actually as oil heats up it becomes thinner, hot oil is thin oil. The colder oil gets the more viscous it is (thicker).
I still say that you should try a NORMAL oil (none of this thin junk). If the normal oil is where you're having problems, then it's time to get intimate with your engine. Running diesel in the oil during normal driving is bloody dangerous, and is really not a good move. I know that it might mean that your car runs for now, but seriously...it shouldn't be in there more than it takes to flush the system. |
Bite off more than you can chew, and chew like hell - Peter Brock (1945-2006) |
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Dan
Learner
5 Posts
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Posted - 10 Nov 2006 : 6:55:58 PM
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Thanks Mouce.....I thought that myself about the oil thinning when hot. But then I was told that oil ie 5/40 (5 meaning thinner for cold starts to get the oil up quicker and 40 meaning thickens up at operating temperature) but now I have no idea. Anyway I have changed it to 20/50 and I am back onto the old problem of the oil light coming back on after about 20km of driving at 100km/h.
So I am once again stuck for ideas. I think I will just keep my eye out for a second hand motor because to fix the oil pump and clean the pick up would be easier if the motor was out. So by the time I did all that and put it back in it would probably end up similar price as buying a good second hand motor. |
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mouce
National Driver
1525 Posts
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Posted - 14 Nov 2006 : 3:09:25 PM
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| If I were you I'd just use this as an excuse to do a full reco on the motor that's in there. But that's just me. |
Bite off more than you can chew, and chew like hell - Peter Brock (1945-2006) |
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